Legislature(2003 - 2004)
02/27/2004 01:20 PM House JUD
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
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+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
HB 367 - LICENSING SEX-ORIENTED BUSINESSES Number 0088 CHAIR McGUIRE announced that the first order of business would be HOUSE BILL NO. 367, "An Act relating to the licensing and regulation of sex-oriented businesses and sex-oriented business entertainers; relating to protection of the safety and health of and to education of young persons who perform in adult entertainment establishments; and providing for an effective date." [Before the committee was CSHB 367(L&C).] Number 0280 REPRESENTATIVE ANDERSON moved to adopt the proposed committee substitute (CS) for HB 367, Version 23-LS1394\W, Craver, 2/25/04, as a work draft. There being no objection, Version W was before the committee. Number 0280 CHAIR McGUIRE moved to adopt Amendment 1, which read [original punctuation provided]: Page 10, Line 10: INSERT - Sec.08.90.350. Municipal regulation. A municipality may adopt and enforce an ordinance that places prohibitions or restrictions on adult-oriented entertainment that are additional to or stricter than those required under this chapter. REPRESENTATIVE SAMUELS objected. He proposed that Amendment 1 be amended to include boroughs as well as municipalities. REPRESENTATIVE GARA offered that Amendment 1 could be changed by adding "a local government's municipality or other local government's subdivision." And asked if that would cover everything. REPRESENTATIVE SAMUELS recollected that the previous year the legal definitions were explained to him and he thought that the proposed amendment to Amendment 1 would be correct, but he wasn't sure. CHAIR McGUIRE suggested that the committee stick with the original amendment, stating that she thought the other Representatives were correct but she didn't want to broaden the terms when the definition wasn't certain. She said that she would seek an answer to the question and provide it before the bill [is heard in] the House Finance Committee. REPRESENTATIVE SAMUELS said he would agree to that, as long as the issue was addressed. He shared that the only circumstance that he could think this issue would effect was the Fairbanks Northstar Borough and he wanted to make sure that they had the same authority as every other municipality. Number 0380 REPRESENTATIVE SAMUELS removed his objection with the understanding that the issue would be addressed before HB 367 [is heard in the next] committee. CHAIR McGUIRE asked if there were any further objections to adopting Amendment 1. Hearing none, Amendment 1 was adopted. Number 0418 REPRESENTATIVE GARA moved to adopt Amendment 2, [which would replace the text of Version W, as amended, with the proposed CS for HB 367, Version 23-LS1394\V, Craver, 2/23/04]. He explained that the only substantive difference was that this version would allow patrons to go to establishments that didn't serve alcohol when they were 18 years old and older. REPRESENTATIVE SAMUELS objected. CHAIR McGUIRE stated that she has an issue with the bifurcated age, wherein patrons can be 18 and dancers have to be 21, that Representative Gara is proposing. She said she'd received enough compelling evidence from former and current strippers, police officers, and a neuropsychologist to lead her to believe that the dangers that are present in these types of establishments exist to both patron and stripper. So although the greater harm is probably to the stripper, she is even more concerned about both patrons and strippers now that she has heard testimony relating to drugs, alcohol, and the intoxicated people that come into these clubs. She stated that she felt that the age requirement of 21 should be consistent for everyone. She expressed that she didn't want people under the age of 21 gambling, drinking, or going to these clubs. She cited the Barnes v. Glen Theatre, Inc. court case, which ruled that dancers and patrons in strip clubs are not protected by the First Amendment. Chair McGuire concluded by thanking Representative Gara for his help in developing HB 367, and emphasized that the main purpose of the bill is to protect young people from the types of ills that have been exposed during the formation of HB 367. REPRESENTATIVE ANDERSON said he agrees with Chair McGuire's statements. He explained that during the House Labor and Commerce Standing Committee hearings on HB 367, the arguments for designating the minimum age at 21 to attend these clubs were most compelling. He stated that the Covenant House, the neuropsychologist, the Parent Teacher Association (PTA), and the police officers shared a lot of information that guided the development of the 21-year-old minimum age requirement. REPRESENTATIVE ANDERSON shared his hope that this bill sets the standard for the country when dealing with issues such as this. He acknowledged that the bill may not be consistent with the rest of the country, but it illustrates Alaska's different perspective. He recognized the argument that HB 367 may not hold up to a legal challenge, but he hoped that the courts would see the intent of the bill and uphold the 21-year-old minimum. He shared that he was trying to curb the use of drugs and alcohol as well as young people's exposure to violence and other crimes. REPRESENTATIVE ANDERSON shared his respect for the owners of these establishments. He clarified that [the legislature] is not being punitive, but rather is looking at this issue from a public policy prospective. He said that he feels that [the legislature] is making the right decision. Representative Anderson referred to a conversation that he'd had with the Executive Director of the Anchorage Cabaret Hotel Restaurant & Retailers Association (CHARR) where it was relayed to him that the board is still debating the issue and hasn't formed an official opinion. Number 0919 REPRESENTATIVE GARA commented that he appreciated the disagreement. He stated that despite this particular philosophical difference, he felt that the rest of the bill was very strong. He explained that HB 367 started out a lot broader and has been tightened up throughout the committee process. He shared that he didn't like the idea of 18 and 19 year olds going to strip clubs, but he also didn't like telling them that they could not go. He said he felt that it was a situation where he should bite his lip; he may disagree with the parents that would allow their children go to places like this at that age, but he doesn't feel that it is his place to tell them what to do. He also shared his concern that by increasing the patronage age to 21, some of these establishments may lose a significant amount of business. He said that he would rather see the patronage age remain 18 years old and regulate the area of greatest evil, which is the abuse that some of these young women who strip undertake. He concluded by saying that he would support HB 367 with or without the adoption of Amendment 2. Number 1001 A roll call vote was taken. Representatives Gara and Gruenberg voted in favor of Amendment 2. Representatives Samuels, Anderson, Ogg, and McGuire voted against it. Therefore, Amendment 2 failed by a vote of 2-4. CHAIR McGUIRE directed attention back to HB 367. She mentioned a conversation that she and Representative Gara had wherein they decided to put on the record the legal, scientific, and community information that has been presented and reviewed during the formation of HB 367. She highlighted the testimony that had made the most significant impact for her. She referred to the Anchorage Council PTA, stating that it was the PTA who contacted both her and Representative Gara and got the legislation started. She shared that the PTA was reacting to teacher observations and talking to former and current strippers who were living at Covenant House. CHAIR McGUIRE said that these girls informed the PTA and other various committees that they had been propositioned for prostitution and drug use. She said that the girls felt that they were worse off after the dancing experience. She referred to the teachers who said that high-school girls who were stripping, and high-school boys who were patronizing these establishments were acting as a detraction in the school. She shared that at the Anchorage caucus meeting they heard testimony from high-school kids who were stripping. She said that they made a point of having to hurry up and testify because it was their "night time". She pointed out that the time they were testifying was noon, a time when most high-school kids would be in class, and said she found it interesting that these kids were dancing through the night, sometimes until 5:00 a.m., and going to school a little over an hour later. She said that she saw a problem with that. Number 1209 CHAIR McGUIRE referred to the resolution provided by the Alaska State PTA and the Anchorage Council PTA at the Anchorage caucus. She pointed out that there are over 3,400 students in Anchorage alone, and some of these high-school kids are between the ages of 18 and 20. She reminded the committee that the mandatory age for starting school is 6 years old. She said that if a child falls back a year, they could easily be 18 or 19 when they are seniors in high school. Chair McGuire stated that she was 18 for half of her senior year. She pointed out that in the resolution there are references to concern over unwanted pregnancies and sexual assaults. She also mentioned that there are a disproportionate number of calls to the police from these establishments. CHAIR McGUIRE, as a comparison between one of these businesses and Chilkoot Charlie's, a well known, lively, alcohol-serving establishment in the heart of Anchorage, she stated that there is still more police involvement at a strip club than at Chilkoot Charlie's. She asked the committee to stop and think about that fact. She emphasized that the types of calls the police get from these establishments include kidnapping, rape, assault, and drug use. Chair McGuire then questioned how these establishments compare with "Bernie's or Humpy's." She said that she used Anchorage examples because that is where she lives, and informed the committee that an Anchorage police sergeant has informed her that those establishments make zero calls relating to similar crimes. CHAIR McGUIRE stated that strip clubs are unregulated, so there is no mechanism for people in the community to enforce verification of age. She added that until HB 367 gets, there is no law that enforces any regulations for these establishments, and so even something like failure to verify someone's age is something that there are no consequences for. Number 1354 CHAIR McGUIRE pointed out that in the aforementioned resolution, many legal findings from various cities around the country were cited in the section under "it is known that," She referred to the "secondary harmful effect" evidence that was used to illustrate the need for this legislation. She commented that such evidence can be gathered from other communities as well. She said that since Alaska is a newer state and Anchorage and Fairbanks are relatively young towns, it strengthens their case for this legislation by focusing on older, faster growing communities and relating it to what may happen in Alaska if these clubs go unregulated. She referred again to the "it is known that," section of the resolution and used the example given that all types of crimes, especially sex-related crimes, occur with more frequency in neighborhoods where sex-oriented businesses are located. CHAIR McGUIRE cited studies conducted in Phoenix, Arizona; Indianapolis, Indiana; and Austin, Texas. She referred to testimony that other illegal activities are being performed at these clubs in the parking lots or in the booths and cubicles. She noted that these activities are also being performed in Anchorage and Fairbanks. She relayed that in the resolution, it says that it is known that there is increased drug activity surrounding adult establishments. Chair McGuire also pointed out that a 9th circuit case in Kitsap County, Washington has shown that contact between dancers and patrons can transmit up to 50 communicable diseases. She emphasized that regulating time, place, and manner of sex-oriented businesses to advance substantial governmental interest is the appropriate thing for a community to do to curb the illegal activities and the harm that can come about from them. Number 1521 CHAIR McGUIRE moved onto the legal opinion prepared by Jeffrey Friedman on February 16, 2004. She shared that Mr. Friedman's opinion relates to the case, Mickens v. City of Kodiak, and offered that even though that case is clearly relevant to what HB 367 proposes, there are some notable differences. First, she stated, the legislature has heard far more scientific testimony about the ill effects of this type of entertainment. She pointed out that a neuropsychologist has testified, as well as have various counselors, identifying the various negative effects stemming from these establishments. She also noted that there has been a lot of personal testimony from dancers recounting their personal experiences from working in these businesses. Reading again from Mr. Friedman's legal opinion, Chair McGuire stated that unlike the situation involved in Mickens v. City of Kodiak, the legislature has heard testimony illustrating the difficulty of enforcing health and safety laws. CHAIR McGUIRE said that that is one of the biggest problems that this bill addresses: there is no mechanism, currently, that will help enforce the things that are happening in these establishments. She also cited that there is difficulty enforcing wage and hour laws. She stated that she'd heard a lot of testimony relating to club owners having the dancers hired under independent contractor status, something that is illegal. She explained that in such situations, the dancers have to pay a fee up front before they can dance at the establishment, and this can lead to dancers turning to prostitution or dealing drugs to make the extra money. She offered her understanding that it is Mr. Friedman's opinion that the legislature is on the right track by prohibiting dancers and patrons who are under the age of 21 from going to or working at adult oriented businesses. She also referred to a letter from Regina Manteufel dated January 27, 2004, that cites many examples of illegal labor laws and many other illegal activities that happen in or around strip clubs. Number 1769 CHAIR McGUIRE said that she was going to recap the testimony received by Scott Swartzwelder, Ph.D., Clinical Professor of Psychiatry and Behavioral Sciences, Duke University Medical Center, and explained that Dr. Swartzwelder's particular expertise is assessing brain development of young people until their 20s. She first gave a little background about Dr. Swartzwelder, how he had testified throughout the country on many bills that are designed to raise the alcohol and/or smoking limit to 21 years of age, and noted that many times, these types of laws are controversial as well. CHAIR McGUIRE said that Dr. Swartzwelder's illustrated how the brain continues to develop until a person is into his/her 20s. The particular areas that are developing are the frontal lobe, an area that controls judgment and impulses. Therefore, although people make decisions throughout their lives, when a person is younger and his/her brain hasn't developed completely, he/she is more likely to make irrational decisions. She used examples such as drinking and driving, drug use, [committing crimes to procure] quick cash, and [making inappropriate] sexual advances, to illustrate Dr. Swartzwelder's points. CHAIR McGUIRE praised the testimony given by Kara Nyquist, Director of Advocacy at Covenant House in Anchorage, who shared the things she had experienced first hand when trying to put someone's life back together after they have started out in the business of stripping. Number 1914 REPRESENTATIVE GARA identified the things that made him feel that HB 367 needed to be enacted. He referred to information that he gathered at the Anchorage caucus where it was said that many times dancers are subjected to wage violations and are too intimidated to say anything about it. He reiterated that some of these women have to pay the establishment for stage time and do not receive a minimum wage. He also shared his concern that the dancers have to give some of their tips to bouncers, stating that if someone doesn't tip well they may not receive as adequate a level of protection as he/she should, and opined that that is a bad way to run that type of business. He also used examples of testimony received wherein women have stated they were propositioned by pimps and drug dealers to work for them and make extra money. Representative Gara said that this isn't the type of situation he would feel comfortable having an 18-, 19-, or 20-year-old working in. He made the point that he didn't want this to be the first job opportunity that a young girl has out of high school, adding that she may never leave it. REPRESENTATIVE GARA acknowledged that there are some businesses that are run cleanly, and stated that this is a case wherein a portion of the businesses do a poor job and it effects everyone else. He referenced a study that dealt with strip clubs in Minneapolis, Minnesota, where it is similar to Anchorage and Fairbanks and the women have to pay to work at the clubs. In that study, 100 percent of the women reported physical abuse while at work, 100 percent said that they had witnessed others getting physically abused at work, 77 percent reported being stalked, 100 percent reported that they had been propositioned for prostitution, 94 percent had their breasts grabbed during work, 60 percent had genitals exposed to them, 78 percent had witnessed customers masturbating in front of them, 56 percent were bitten by customers, 61 percent were spit upon, 39 percent suffered bodily penetration while working, and many were propositioned by pimps while at work. Representative Gara reiterated that this isn't a job that he feels young women under 21 years of age should work in. REPRESENTATIVE GARA said that although jobs like these can be beneficial for certain young men and women, he is confident that those people will be able to find stable, good jobs somewhere else, and noted that when they turn 21 they will be able to once again work in these establishments. He said that he has heard of many cases of broken lives, where women work in places where they are pressured and subjected to abuse and assault, and that is what he concerned about. He said he supports HB 367 and urged the committee to support it as well. He concluded his testimony by commenting that initially the bill required dancers to get licensed, but because of the feedback received, that language has been removed, and now only the businesses need to be licensed. Number 2162 REPRESENTATIVE ANDERSON moved to report the proposed CS for HB 367, Version 23-LS1394\W, Craver, 2/25/04, as amended, out of committee with individual recommendations and the accompanying fiscal note. There being no objection, CSHB 367(JUD) was reported out of the House Judiciary Standing Committee.
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